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Discussion Starter #1
Have any of you guys seen any gains on a Dyno from timing advance in the low-mid range.

I haven’t run my procom in a while but have been making a few maps lately and was curious if the timing advance offered gains.

I do remember my bike seemed to launch harder when I had the procom on.

What’s your experience??
 

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Cars with variable valve timing are using ignition advance to increase torque in the bottom end rpm....its "variable valve" because its only the intake that advances, the exhaust advance would increase fuel consumption. So there is a benefit if the tune is correct. It depends on your fuel octane...maximum combustion needs to occur at 12 to 15 degrees after top dead center for maximum power to occur...the higher the octane the slower it burns and the more advance is needed because it takes longer to burn and gives the piston a harder push and a longer push...

Ive been playing with this for over a week...i am using a pcv with autotune and 93 gas ...i am currently 5degrees advance at the lower end and taper off by 10% throttle and 3000rpm roughly. It allows my bottom end rev to accel very quickly...

I also just got a pod-300 so i can data log...i will know the full effect of advancement in the next couple of days.

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Discussion Starter #3
Awesome, curious to see your results.

This is a copy of map 9 from the procom. The timing advance is shown.

It has a total of 3 degrees in the lower rpm range.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
X1000

I see your making your on a arms. That’s awesome. I wish I new how to lol I want more width

Been running a 3 button controller for awhile and want to give the procom another chance.
 

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Yeah i cant wait to get the a arms finished. I have been practicing for a tig test i have coming up so i had to put them on the back burner for a min but i am going to blueprint them and if all goes well i may start fabricating them for other ppl at a much cheaper price than everyone charges!

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By the way i have received the pod-300 and i can data log but now i dont have a computer to see the data logs...mines too old....i will definitely continue down this road as soon as i can make time....
These welding tests are for my job so the practice comes first!

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Discussion Starter #8
Good luck on the test.

Ya I need to get some wider a arms. If they turn out good maybe I’ll buy a set
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I’ve got my procom map setup and ready to load.

Going to run it with stock fuel map and just timing added. I’m pleased with the fuel settings from my wiseco programmer.

Just added timing so we will see how it runs
 

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Please post your results i cant wait to see what happens!
I can honestly say that the most power you can get is not the best for your engine though. Thats why a dyno is the best way to do it but most of us dont have that advantage. As im dialing mine in on a safe long term tune i am less impressed as i go...lol
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Ya i definitely play it safe.
These machines will run one 87 so Advancing timing a little bit is ok with 91.

Heck I know someone running 13.8 compression with his kawi in Oregon 92 pump gas....
Ported head, bored throttle body etc etc.

Post a pic when those a arms are done!
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Loaded the modified map!

I’ll probably do a ride with the stock ecu then swap on the procom to see if i notice a difference. Especially down low.

I plugged the procom into the computer before I turned the computer on and it worked just fine
 

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Hey if you happen to be able would you please post a pic of the procom map #9 just like u did before?
Thank you
I cant get mine to connect so i have no idea what its doing to the ignition timing.

I have a stock ecu and a procom. I have a stock regulator, and i have a procom regulator. I also have a pcv with autotune.

Im not done tuning yet but what i can say is that the voltage that the procom regulator puts out is better...the stock regulator while riding runs at a consistent 13.7 volts and the procom runs about 14.4v. Its hard for me to explain this briefly but both ecu's have wasted spark which means they fire the ignition on every revolution because it doesnt know which on is the combustion stroke...now i have an accel jeep coil and an iridium plug so i am getting very good ignition. I run 93 octane which burns a little slower than 87 but generally burns all the way up during the combustion stroke. However if i use the stock ecu with pcv and the stock regulator and i keep my afr the same because i can watch what it is on the pod-300 while its happening, then there is very little fuel left on the exhaust stroke and it almost never ignites twice.
Thats at 13.7v but if i change only the regulator to the procom regulator which runs at 14.4v the increase in voltage increases my ignition spark enough to ignite the little bit of fuel still not burnt by the time the exhaust stroke comes. (At an idle and very low rpm) this is not desirable. So when i use the procom ecu which ignites better then the stock ecu it gets even worse...but it if i knew what the advance is on the highest map i may be able to add what it does at wide open throttle....because im scared to try it with out knowing that its been done. Lol

I can elaborate on any one part if anyone needs it or all of it but i tried to keep it as short as i could but still get the point across. My end goal is still to run the procom ecu with the pcv. Its hard to find the time.

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Discussion Starter #14
Stock ecu doesnt read wasted spark.

So when you use the pcV with the procom it has issues. Unless you can update the pcV to read wasted spark.

Let me get a close up picture of the timing advance.

I’m going to stick the procom on when I go to the dunes in a week. See if I can tell a difference with the timing advance
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Also, you cant read what’s on the procom. It’s write only.

You can download map 1-10 from procom’s site!
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Here is the pics.

Also, when I make maps I make the timing advance come in at 2k rpms instead of 1500 like the default.

This makes starting wayyyy easier.

I added timing vs Rpm. Timing vs. TPS
 

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Is it working out for you? I mean can u see a definite difference? I think i have zero advance past like 3000rpm...id like to try it but the harder the engine is running the more damage that can be done if something's wrong. Im going to try to move my advance up a little higher in the rpm and see what happens.

And the stock ecu is a wasted spark ecu just like the procom and so are almost all simple single cylinder engines. Its not that the ecu reads it differently, its just a way of making it cheaper for production. I can prove it in a video...it just means that it fires the spark plug on every revolution instead of every other revolution (in a single cylinder engine). Without a cam shaft sensor the ecu has no way of knowing when the combustion stroke is coming so it fires on both the exhaust and combustion stroke. It has little to no effect and it ensures that the plug timing lands on the combustion stroke. Pull ur plug out and attach it to the coil and grab the rubber boot with a pair of pliers and simply touch the threaded area to metal and turn the engine over with the start button. Pay attention to the spark frequency as it cranks over. Now switch the ecu out and do it again... u will see that it fires at the same rate and since ur cranking with the starter u know its the same rpm. If u need more proof get a bright flashlight and hold the plug right above the hole and watch the piston with the flashlight as u see the spark happen on every revolution. If you need more proof use a timing light while the bike is running. It will light up every time it sparks. Now swap out the ecu and watch with the light again. You will see the same rate of fire from both ecus. Procom and stock. I spent weeks figuring this out and after many calls and emails i got to speak to the head of r&d at dynojet. The pcv knows when to fire the injector based on a ground signal sent from the ecu to the coil, and it is made from resistors soldered to the board and is not adjustable by firmware.

It doesnt effect anything by firing the plug every time but that way you know your hitting the correct stroke with ignition and you didnt need to spend the extra money on an extra sensor (hall effect cam sensor) or have to have a more advanced ecu. Its the same as the engine on ur lawnmower... ever time a variable reluctance transducer (pick up coil) passes a ferrous piece of metal it creates a signal from a magnetic field and thats how the coil knows when to fire. So considering it has only one combustion stroke and it has to go up and down 2 times to complete a four stroke revolution, that means its firing 2 times on a single four stroke cycle. Meaning it fired once on the combustion stroke and once again on the exhaust stroke. Hence "wasted spark". Thats fine for a carburetor engine but if you want to add an injector you need to measure many things in order to know how much gas is needed, and thats why we have an ecu. Im not saying if you have a carburetor engine that you dont have an ecu...im saying if you have a fuel injected engine you have an ecu for sure. Sorry this is so long. I have so much information but its hard to explain it all and have people understand without being pretty thorough.

And i will do a larger write up with facts but the procom does work with the pcv without a firmware updste. It's complicated as well and will require a long segment as well.

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Hey man i got the pcv w/autotune to work with the procom ecu and procom regulator, and no firmware or patch from dynojet. If you need to know or have someone else that needs it id be happy to help. This kinda sounds like a sales pitch lol but i dont want anything but to help. I can prove it with numbers and facts and tell you how to prove it youself.

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Discussion Starter #19
Awesome! Glad you got it figured out.

I’m not so lucky.

My procom won’t run the fuel pump.

Kind of pissed. It has 20 hours on it and I haven’t used it in 3 years
 

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I find it weird that my procom only runs the fuel pump when its been cranked over. Every time you hit the kill switch or key the stock ecu runs the pump....but the procom only does it if its cranked and didn't start. I didnt pay attention until i just read ur post.

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