Epic fail!!!!!

[Duster]

Yeah, see I was thinking since I read all this testimonial swearing... that if I could get enough air in over the top with the box this high... that I'd just slap an outerwears kind of lid on there and be golden.

But the testimonial swearing is all bullchit...
It's too easy to get too much up there for that to work (so I have other plans).
It will just get up there and leach down through.

I was concerned with this though because I was always getting stuff on the top of my stock box lid. I thought it was coming up from the sides and figured a full subframe width box would handle it. It stops that aspect over the sides, but it's not enough.

I have an idea that I think will be a solution.
Just gotta fit and build it.

[ononewheel]

my fci w/box and pre filter get a little dusty now and again during the summer months but water croosings/mud crossings it never gets that dirty!!!you should also have the pre filter wrap on there that will help a bunch!and as for inspection of the actual intake tube clean a s can be actually just cleaned it today was pretty dusty but insid ethe tube was spotless!oh and as i stopped for a quick break today i had a buddy checkin out my ride and guess what he found my sprocket was kinda loose!so i looked closer and bam all 4 bolts snapped!!!!!luckily i took 4 outa my frame/motor mounts etc and some xtra nuts and fixed it and rode all day!

[nkeen07]

Duster Duster Duster...I'm wondering when you'll ever let go of your stubborn side. Probably never, but oh well. We're all stubborn in our own ways. People weren't swearing that they didn't get ANYTHING in their boxes. I for sure didn't say nothing was getting in my box. I admitted that you'll get some mud/water splashed, but as long as you run an Outerwears then you're fine. Your oil that you thought would be awesome, obviously didn't do anything. I clean my filter every ride/race (the one that came w/my Fuel ATV boxed intake), and yes it does get filthy even w/an outerwears, but if it didn't it wouldn't be doing its job (before you ask I use K&N oil applied PROPERLY). I've run all season w/o cleaning out my intake tube. Well, finally my wire tap for my PCIII cut through my TPS sensor and my quad was cutting out the whole last round, so I decided I'd take 'er all apart and clean/inspect everything. What'd I find in my intake tube? NOTHING! Perfectly clean except for a little oil residue from being blown out of the crankcase. 9 rounds of XC racing along w/normal trail riding, in way worse conditions than your quad has ever seen, and I had NOTHING in my intake. Get over this...we're all tired of your trying to make everything that's not yours look bad. I really really like that you're experimenting and trying to get a good set-up...we all learn and benefit from this. But this is what you need to do...experiment and report your findings, but make them factual...not YOUR opinion on YOUR products, or other companies products that YOU have no experience with for that matter.

[nkeen07]

PS: I feel like you took watered down clay and threw it at your intake...haha. Even w/the worst conditions I've raced in I barely ever see that much in or around the box.

[blacksunshine]

hmmm. ...........makes you wonder.

[Duster]

Well, you all seen the pictures of me and how totally non-extreme the situation was.

What ticks me off is that you guys tout these intakes that have far less protection from stuff getting in than my little box blank I was testing with. And it ticks me off because this is clearly a pack of lies.

I mean you all had me comfortable testing with no lid until I could get an idea of how much more intake area would be needed for my setup if any beyond the crack between the top and the seat.

And I would have had the outerwear on there, but this was the first run with the tacky oil.
It did work on stopping the dust from passing by the way.

Now had I had the outerwear on there, it would have helped, but would not have stopped what happened. It would have stuck to the outerwear the same way and weeped it's way through.


Overall though, I thought I was in very good shape until we took this trail late in the day. We went through water several times that day and I stopped every time and was dry as a bone. This place had like 4 trails that didn't just cross water... you actually rode down the creek a ways and picked up the creek exit a ways down. They were all slow crossings though, and the creek bottoms were solid and rocky.

The problem came with the spinning in that muddy section.

I never would have thought it got in like that, but I am lucky we stopped to talk and laugh about it. We did because it wasn't extreme... not deep or anything... just slick as snot. But glad we stopped because I pulled the seat to knock the mud off... and saw what I saw. Pulled the plug and drained her out because that could have been a disaster otherwise.

That oil had like no water resistance at all... not at all waterproof as Maxima claims.

Stopping when I did, and the curve in the LTR tube saved my azz...

[Duster]

Quote: Originally Posted by nkeen07

Get over this...we're all tired of your trying to make everything that's not yours look bad. I really really like that you're experimenting and trying to get a good set-up...we all learn and benefit from this. But this is what you need to do...experiment and report your findings, but make them factual...not YOUR opinion on YOUR products, or other companies products that YOU have no experience with for that matter.

Now this part I DEEPLY RESENT...

I don't get how I'm trying to make what's not mine look bad?
Hell that's my intake man... in epic failure...

And talking comparison, you gotta be on friggin crack if you can't see how my box blank I was running offers way more protection than anything aftermarket.

It goes up higher on all sides... is totally sealed up to the sub frame on all sides... and thank god had a lot more depth safety area under the filter.

Had this been any of the other intakes, the bottom of the filter would have been submerged in water and mud.


And yeah, I am trying to come up with a better setup. I'm doing it because I don't see where I have another option short of selling the KFX, which I don't want to do. So it is either overcome this issue if I want to ride the bike anywhere or any time that is not dry.

And along the way, I am reporting my findings... which are dead factual... and this incident in particular has me fired up pretty good because because of all the BS that's flying around here.


I just thank my lucky stars that I stuck with my gut instinct from my own experience with the stock setup and didn't just take the easy road on this and buy an aftermarket intake.

Otherwise that little spot there in the trail that got my pants a little muddy would have ended in me getting towed out of the woods for a rebuild.


And you guys running these aftermarket intakes can also count your lucky stars that you have been this lucky this long.... cause I still can't get over how easily that happened to me.... and how close I was to disaster.

[DirtyDawg]

"Yet you all want to swear your little shields are impenetrable."

I been following the thread about your intake and box since you started it. I don't recall anyone saying thier FCI or FUELATV box was impenetrable, just that they don't get that much crud in them. I know my current setup works very well for my application, which are some of the dustiest conditions known to mankind. I'll just leave it at that. I do believe you are really trying to come up with a better mouse trap, which is great, and I commend you on that. But I will say with a fair amount of certainty, that an outerwears would have prevented the inside of the filter and tube from looking that way. I don't see your efforts as an "epic fail". I just think going thru mud an crap without an outerwears made the results almost predictable. I actually think your pretty much on the right track. Personally I think your current box design , with an outerwears type lid, and S&B filter, would probably provide you with more than enough protection, JMHO. I wouldn't get so worked up about it though. I know you been working on this for quite some time, and trial and error can be a frastrating road, but you'll eventually figure out a sollution that works for you. Keep working on it

[nkeen07]

Quote: Originally Posted by Duster

Quote: Originally Posted by nkeen07

Get over this...we're all tired of your trying to make everything that's not yours look bad. I really really like that you're experimenting and trying to get a good set-up...we all learn and benefit from this. But this is what you need to do...experiment and report your findings, but make them factual...not YOUR opinion on YOUR products, or other companies products that YOU have no experience with for that matter.

Now this part I DEEPLY RESENT...

I don't get how I'm trying to make what's not mine look bad?
Hell that's my intake man... in epic failure...

And talking comparison, you gotta be on friggin crack if you can't see how my box blank I was running offers way more protection than anything aftermarket.

It goes up higher on all sides... is totally sealed up to the sub frame on all sides... and thank god had a lot more depth safety area under the filter.

Had this been any of the other intakes, the bottom of the filter would have been submerged in water and mud.


And yeah, I am trying to come up with a better setup. I'm doing it because I don't see where I have another option short of selling the KFX, which I don't want to do. So it is either overcome this issue if I want to ride the bike anywhere or any time that is not dry.

And along the way, I am reporting my findings... which are dead factual... and this incident in particular has me fired up pretty good because because of all the BS that's flying around here.


I just thank my lucky stars that I stuck with my gut instinct from my own experience with the stock setup and didn't just take the easy road on this and buy an aftermarket intake.

Otherwise that little spot there in the trail that got my pants a little muddy would have ended in me getting towed out of the woods for a rebuild.


And you guys running these aftermarket intakes can also count your lucky stars that you have been this lucky this long.... cause I still can't get over how easily that happened to me.... and how close I was to disaster.

Put drain holes in the bottom of your box. I did at the front 2 corners of my FuelATV box and I've never had problems w/submerging the filter...even when power washing. I know you'll most likely say this will hurt your water-fording abilities, but the fact is that it's a KFX450 sport atv and if you're going to be going through water that deep it's not the quad you should be on anyways. An outerwears would have prevented this even further, as I said. It wasn't an epic failure b/c it was a learning experience. I know that you're testing the oil, and that's awesome that you're trying a different route, but the fact is that you can't run that type of element off-road w/o having an outerwears on it...plain and simple.

All I and everyone else are saying is that you need to stop saying we're all lying about our set-ups. Honestly, you would think that you'd understand that after so many people say they're good, that you'd maybe start believing. I can't speak for FCI's set-up b/c I've never owned one, but I can say that the FuelATV set-up w/box has worked great for me this season...and we've had some crazy creek crossings and horrible conditions. YES...like I've said MULTIPLE times, there is stuff that gets into the box, but it's nothing that the Outerwears can't take care of. NOONE ever said they were an impenetrable box...noone (You are the one who said it...and we all corrected your understanding).

Get upset w/me all you want, but all I'm saying is that you really aren't in a position to bash on other companies products that you haven't run, both in the flow and cleanliness departments when it comes to intakes. Sure...everyone has a right to an opinion b/c that's what forums are about, but an opinion about something you know nothing about is different and unnecessary.

Keep up the work on your set-up. I, and I'm sure everyone else, would like to eventually see what your final product is. Like I've said every time, I think it's looking good and seams to be a great start.

[Duster]

DirtyDawg,

What I reference is not just what is in these threads... but the accumulation of comments over say the last year or longer.

These guys talk about these shield boxes as if they were impenetrable. They talk like they blast creeks and mudholes... and on and on and never get anything inside the boxy... which has to be a lie, unless I am moving a huge amount more air... which has already been implied impossible.

I've read where guys say they pressure wash and don't even get anything in there... etc...

Now in more recent months it's shifting to, well stuff gets in there but it is not enough to matter. Again, that's gotta be bullsh.....


I'm telling you, if I'm lying I'm dying... if you had been with me on that ride, you would have trashed your motor before passing through that little section of trail. Not even a tiny doubt in my mind.

The top of your filter would have been caked, and the bottom of your filter would have been submerged in what got in. Three things saved my motor. The big one is I had like 2" of catch area between the bottom extreme of my filter and the bottom of the box. The next is that we stopped so I checked and drained. And last was the LTR tube was well oiled inside and the stuff didn't slide on around the bend into the throttle body.

And I know you think your outerwear would have protected you... but it would not have. I'll have to take you a detail pic of the filter. It caved the accordion of the filter media in. It pulled the pleats down and bent the inside screen down, pulling the media away from the outside metal screening.

If you think for a second it wouldn't have sucked that through an outerwear and into the filter you are sadly mistaken.


But otherwise on my layout there you are on track for what I was thinking of for my personal use. I figured I'd do an outerwear sort of lid layout in addition to the outerwear on the filter... and a relief valve somewhere in case the lid got slimed.

The only two steps I had left before that was... one, the stopping the dust... and two, riding with and without the seat to confirm rather or not just doing such a lid would offer plenty of intake area or not.

I can see now though that this is not going to work for my layout. I mean I think it would do remarkably well. But I'm not blind to the fact that stuff would get up on top of that sort of lid and leech through... and over the coarse of a long ride you'd have an issue on your hands.

So I am going to build the next 3 layouts to test and see which one is best.

And I think everyone is going to be a great deal more impressed with these than the blank test box I was running here.